Okay... This is one thing that I'm curious about because I'm of the mindset that Homosexuality isn't really a choice, you're either Gay, Bisexual or Straight (I know that a lot of homosexuals dispute this, but there's been enough credible scientific work to at best discredit the idea that homosexuality is strictly a choice).
There is an alarming thing happening in that a few faith-based and even quackery based pseudo-medical conditioning experiments are being conducted to "cure" homosexuality.
Now, I might be a little off base, but what is so wrong with it in the first place? I know straight, gay and bi sluts... it seems that promiscuity is more of sin in some evangelicals' eyes when it's accompanied by homosexuality.
How do you "fix" something like that? Especially when it's like eye colour, something that you don't get to pick?
I may be going out on a limb here, but these people that are convinced they can fix gayness are akin to Dr. Josef Mengele in my mind. They might think they're bringing about the greater good, but they're gratuitously harming people that have nothing wrong with them other than what is against their own societal constructs.
The first part about using shock "therapy" to cure homosexuality... it's quack science. There is ECT (electro-convulsive therapy) which is has a clinical use and has been proved useful in treating some disorders, but that uses relatively low doses, and it's used to correct specific organic disorders. Shock-therapy isn't useful to correct behaviour, and most psychiatrists don't consider homosexuality to be a personality disorder. Am I alone in this?
What's got me on this jag?
http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1595 <-- Worth watching even if you get to watch a promo for the TV Show.
A friend of mine and I were talking a few days ago, and he came out of the closet. I more or less knew he was at least Bi, but the fact that he came out was reassuring... it's like getting a monkey off your back I'm told. He had come out to his folks (who are pretty understanding, they're not tightly wound or anything) but one of his aunts is fanatically religious and offered this treatment, and she won't talk to him, look at him etc. unless he goes through with this treatment. She's his God mother, and he doesn't want to lose that relationship (they're close apparently), but this... this is looking like a deal breaker. I told him that it's not him that's forcing this on anyone, but he's not to blame for her choice, and by choice, I mean the choice to ignore Jesus' teachings (Love thy God, Love thy neighbour). I hope I that I gave sage advice...
Does anyone else think there's an agenda here, or is it good people doing terrible things for misguided reasons?
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
I think the religious fanatics believe it's a disease and can be cured. Me, I don't think there is a "cure" or any disease or anything wrong with homosexuality. Like you said, good people doing terrible things for misguided reasons.
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* Student of the University of Oklahoma. Go Sooners!
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Highly religious people attempting stupid @!#$? No way!
If you actually watch the clip, 4% of the people that go into these programs actually go on to live a heterosexual lifestyle... However, they are usually employed in the ex-gay groups and end up having to live the life... the other 96%: I think about 30-40% become celibate, and the rest just go back to being homosexual.
What a tragic farce.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
reminds me of the South Park where the parents think Butters is "bi-curious" and they send him to a camp to change him. Turns out all of the people the Bible-thumpers send to the camp are not "cured" of their gayness, they are just thrown back into the closet. Half of them committ suicide. I wonder what they think is worse to God, suicide or gayness?
At the risk of being seen as speaking for God, I think that self-denial is worse.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
GAM (The Kilted One) wrote: I know straight, gay and bi sluts...
What kinda crowd you hangin' out with?
College crowd
And sluts come in the male and female varieties.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
You want a good laugh about the "gay cure" watch Saved!
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* Student of the University of Oklahoma. Go Sooners!
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I don't see why everyone is so worried about gay people and what others do with themselves. By everyone, I'm meaning the religious folks that say it's wrong, as well as these people trying to "cure" it. Who cares? Just concentrate on you, and don't be preoccupied with your fellow man and his actions.
I think ECT should be employed to cure religious fanaticism...after all, it is a disease and those people need help!
Goodbye Callisto & Skaši, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
You'd think they'd cure the common cold, or uptight ass
hole Republican-ness first.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
Bigots use religion to mask their own personal hatred. That is why certain people are more concerned about "gayness" being a sin, rather than attack say...murderers, or thiefs.
There is no way of changing them, I know this for a fact, because there is no way to turn me gay.
GAM (The Kilted One) wrote:I more or less knew he was at least Bi, but the fact that he came out was reassuring... it's like getting a monkey off your back I'm told.
..
If you actually watch the clip, 4% of the people that go into these programs actually go on to live a heterosexual lifestyle... However, they are usually employed in the ex-gay groups and end up having to live the life... the other 96%: I think about 30-40% become celibate, and the rest just go back to being homosexual.
What a tragic farce.
I think there are probably a lot of people who are bi, but for societal reasons choose to be strictly straight. It's easier to deal with and easy to rationalize. Why deal with what your friend has to deal with? You say your suspect of gay being a choice, but clearly your friend has choosen the gay. He could of just stuck with tits.
These programs are stupid. The 4% who became hetero were probably just gay-leaning bi's in the first place. The 30-40% learn to hate themselves.
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I deal with it because he came out of the closet. I had my suspicions, but I never voiced it to him or anyone, we were in a pretty non-judgemental circle of friends. I seriously doubt that homosexuality is a choice, because I figure it's more than likely there are people that just deny their nature for societal reasons... this is what I think my friend was doing. Not really choosing to be gay, but accepting that he was gay and choosing to drop the facade.
I think personally that MOST people are at least partially bi-sexual with pure heterosexuality being the aberration.
The people that learn to hate themselves, I pity with the deepest sympathy. Just learn to be and love yourself, and let the rest of the world take care of itself.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
I look at this in a much simpler context.
A gay man doesn't turn me on:
An ugly woman doesn't turn me on (yes, i know this is subjective, but everyone has a sense of beauty and standards, thus making it a valid comparison).
Hence, if either tried to get with me i'd tell them no--politely. They have the right to ask, i have the right to refuse. Anything beyond that is harassment, and believe you me, i can be a bastard when harassed.
But on the basal level, i think sexuality is a "superfetish" as it were. Since i don't think fetishes are wrong in any way shpe or form in and of themselves, i don't find sexual preference wrong in any way shape or form in and of itself. In the same way i would not engage in BSDM with anyone that doesn't want to engage in it, I find it wrong to be sexually involved with anyone that doesn't want to be involved with me.
That being said, i also think it's ethically wrong to say what's good and correct for someone, when you haven't walked a mile in their shoes. I further say that if you claim a "higher authority" told you so, you better, (a) prove the existance of that higher authority--if it's existance is merely speculative in the grand-scheme-of-things, and (b) make me submit to the will of that authority.
Good luck on B for ANY deity whatsoever (sorry to those here that i respect that do worship a deity that i don't believe in or choose to recognize).
Goodbye Callisto & Skaši, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
What about child molesters? Is that curable? Why is that wrong, but homosexuality is?
O noes!
Are you playing Devil's Advocate or do you really not know?
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The difference is that homosexuality is consenting human adults.
Goodbye Callisto & Skaši, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Smokey wrote:What about child molesters? Is that curable? Why is that wrong, but homosexuality is?
Keeper hit the nail on the head.
And FYI: Child molesters/rapists come in both male and female varieties, and can choose victims victims of their own, the opposite or either gender.
Molestation/rape is not about sex. It's about power. Sex is incidental.
Homosexuals that keep it with consenting adults (I'm not going to talk about those neo-predators in NAMBLA) are doing nothing illegal.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
I was really hoping he would respond before you answered his question. Now I'll never know if he's a dummy or not.
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Sometimes people are conditioned to ask before they look for themselves.
At least there wasn't a Phelpsian diatribe in the offing.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
At least with bestiality, being an unconsented sex act (similar to pedophilia), there's a good chance that someone will be ramrodded by a phallus that causes internal hemmhoraging.
Kids, on the other hand, aren't initially conditioned to attack a member of NAMBLA that comes onto them with a battery drill or a forklift.
Although, the image of Little Suzie or Little Johnny driving a forklift with Gary Glitter impaled on it is a delightfuly disturbing image.
Goodbye Callisto & Skaši, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Only if Paul Reubens is on the other skew... errr... plate
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
More DA than anything.
Another point: Homosexuality, in the context that it was presented, shouldn't be treated like eye color, because it's not a physical trait. It an emotional/mental state, much like ADD or depression, correct? So would that mean it's possible that there is a way out there to "fix" it, much like Prozac for depression.
O noes!
